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Daylight vs. Serenity Discussion Thread

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Hey all! I've noticed we've all been having some concerns/debates about some manners of execution and more related to the current war (like every other war), but since we're not the same CI we were a year ago, or even several months ago, I hope we can openly discuss our grievances in a responsible and friendly manner.

Staff will keep a watchful eye over this thread, and we'll answer any questions or concerns any of you may have about generally anything you might not be sure of.
As a player, please refrain from answering these such questions directed at Staff, as our policies on what we deem appropriate change from time to time. We're happy to answer them ourselves, and we wouldn't want any misunderstandings from assumptions to occur, so thanks for that in advance!

You all know the forum rules. We expect you to follow them, and not let this turn into a salt-fest like it might've in the past. Respect one another, treat others how you'd want to be treated, and if you don't have anything nice to say, either refrain from saying it or revisit it later. If you have a level head, don't be afraid to share your issues and opinions on what's going on. We want CI to be as fair as possible, and we're always looking to mend anything that thwarts that experience if we can.

So, let's get right into it, shall we?
Posted Jan 22, 19 · OP
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Alright I suppose I will start and just list the things that are bothering me in no particular order.

1. The void portal trick. I understand that from a mech point of view there is nothing wrong with using this tactic but I am worried that future pvp will consist of leaping at your foe and portaling them into the void or some other death trap. Also I am not sure if it has been fixed or not but the portal spell is notorious for lag spikes and crashing people so it feels a bit wrong to use it in pvp. @Rose I am also curious how you got the mark there I know you have a spell to pass though blocks but I would like to know how placing it worked.

2.Stealing items. After a few fights Kehn and I made an agreement that stealing/intentionally destroying each others items would stop. Now this agreement was made IC so back stabbing is fine in RP but I felt there was an ooc aspect to it as well. I could have been mistaken.

3.Offlineing. I try to be on often and at regular times or at lest contactable for planning. So I feel that attacking/griefing Serenity when I am not on is distasteful. especially when you kill special staff mobs

4.Item Glitching. During one of the grief sprees at Serenity someone used Ice spells to break item frames in the big cup. Some of these items were returned when items were being given back to there owner as part of the agreement but several special items seem to be gone. Also some who's name I don't want to know reported me for stealing items off the wall with a spell of mine (I didn't) so I feel its a bit hypocritical.

5. Claiming Serenity. For those who don't know at one point where I was offline a few of my members were banned and Kapp repeatedly killed herself to the point of having a ton of negative power making Serenity claimable. Kap has said that there will be some Rp injures but not from killing herself over and over. I had suspected a betrayal so I had rationed power but by going into the negative it shows that any member regardless of rank in a faction can make it claimable given a bit of time.

6. Child RPs This one is not exclusive to the war and is just a general complaint. Redmond has been getting flack for attacking children. However most of the time I have no idea they are playing a child and even if I did I cant just let a "child" in full dia with high mcmmo stats beat me to death. I feel if your playing a child RP you should not act like an adult especially in a fight.

If I think of anything else as this discussion goes on I will make a new post or edit this one however needed.
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Posted Jan 22, 19
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I recall Eliah giving flack for that whole child-attacking thing when Redmond visited, so I wanted to again clear that up from an OOC perspective. It was secondhand information passed from the injured peeps at Daylight that Redmond hurt Seilah in some attack. She is only classified as a child to Eliah because Eliah's upbringing was rather conservative and she knows a lot of immortal people, so she does view teenagers or very innocent & young people as children (because in this time, nothing really dictates an age of legal adulthood except your own perspective based on how mature someone seems). Eliah has met Seilah a few times and has never seen her in "full dia armour", and I know AquaticSpider doesn't have high stats, and does not act like an adult (you'd find this out if you roleplayed with her for a little while :p). And that's pretty much all I have to say about this! Good luck though!
Thank you for your time out of your busy schedule of asking your mother for hot pockets and getting mad at people over the Internet.

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Posted Jan 22, 19
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Seilah was not the one I was talking about with high stats and good armor. I maybe wrong but I think I went after her because she had been shooting arrows at me. If she is a child (or acts like one) joining up with a vampire hunting guild does not seem like the thing to do.
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Posted Jan 22, 19
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ColbyJWF On Forum
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wrote:
Seilah was not the one I was talking about with high stats and good armor. I maybe wrong but I think I went after her because she had been shooting arrows at me. If she is a child (or acts like one) joining up with a vampire hunting guild does not seem like the thing to do.

For starters I'd say that's a rather irrational reason to warrant harm toward a weaker individual (whether it's a child or not), as well as the fact that arrows are a nuisance at best in PvP against someone of Redmond's strength against an inexperienced archer. When Jay betrayed Anivia and a fight broke out he intentionally went out of his way to not harm any of the weak, but I suppose it all comes down to how honorable someone's RPC is. Another option if you didn't want the backlash could have simply been to have had Redmond scope out or gather intel on those in Daylight before just straight up attacking anyone in his way with full force.
Another personal grievance I would like to point out on both sides is the use of the Brink of Death mechanic, or lack thereof. When you get a death debuff stacked onto you, it is common sense that an injury should (usually) be inflicted onto your RPC (granted some characters do have a better pain tolerance than others). When I see someone with multiple deaths (even up to 5 in some cases) walking around like they're perfectly unchanged it's not only discouraging, but honestly makes me assume you aren't aware of how the mechanic works.

In tyedye's case, I wasn't whatsoever in favor of him having an inactive player with an otherwise unreachable RPC healing (some or all of) his deaths. Getting inactive people to log in and heal your RPC when there are a plethora of healers you could look into also seems rather unfair, and with some prodding I feel comfortable saying (under the right circumstance and stipulations) Jay would have healed Redmond.

If people need encouragement to start using this mechanic properly I'd like you all to realize that while healer's have the capability to mend wounds, they cannot heal their OWN injuries and have to ICly seek out other healers to aid them. The least those who don't play healers can do is not make their RPC's practically invincible.
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Posted Jan 22, 19
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As for killing people weaker than me. When I first attacked I told people I was only after the vampires and left others alone until I was attacked and if someone asked me to stop fighting them IC I normally would if they said they would stop fighting me. Regardless of how honorable you are it does not make a ton of scene to just sit around and let some one shoot you. As for ooc healing I treated death level 1 as a minor injury like a sprain or bad bruising. At level three I had him limping around and stating how he was in no condition to fight. Redmond even went to Aylrah to seek healing and Jay refused. The only way I got healing was by Akwal or a odd unexpected and unreproduce able glitch with a creed bow. As for Q healing me I was trying to get him back on the server but he did something stupid right away.
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Posted Jan 22, 19 · Last edited Jan 22, 19 by tyedye
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I'd like to point that the only time I was killed, I roleplayed out the brink of death mechanic. I don't think I'm at fault for that and I believe many people on Daylight's side did roleplay it out even if that meant being at a mechanical and IC disadvantage regarding the PvP. I don't recall any of our healers ever claiming to be (or acting in such a way so as to insinuate being) OOC.

I think it's completely fair to not want your character to die as long as you are willing to roleplay the healing process, and I advise keeping in mind that you should always consider what will be fun for others as well.

Also, now that I'm here, I'd like to point out that my complaint of tyedye using spells to break blocks and items within claimed land has already been resolved by staff to the best of my knowledge.
Joey-bae: "The front of Thyvor looks ugly"
Gudz-san: "We took inspiration from your face."
Posted Jan 22, 19
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Alright, since the actual events of Serenity's annexation has yet to be written down, I feel as though I--the player that arguably caused this whole debacle in the first place--should be the one who should explain. Maybe I could elaborate on some of the circumstances surrounding it:

First off, I should clarify that "The Siege of Serenity" was not an OOCly-premeditated attack, nor was that the intention from the beginning. The only thing I was really planning that day was to find ways to play catch-up with the MCMMO stats system. Ironically enough, finding ways to MCMMO grind was actually what caused the largest power-drops from Serenity (though it's important to note beforehand that two other players were dropped from the faction before the annexation, and another 2 banned after the fact).

You see, this entire conundrum started when Labyrinth_Magpie and I--both sharing xp using the party system--were contemplating which specific stat we wanted to grind. It was around then that AquaticSpider wanted to test something with her attack dogs, asking for me to punch her and allow the resulting hostile dogs to kill me. I was the kill-candidate because I was in Daylight's enemy faction, Serenity; my status as a faction enemy would help display the most accurate results of the test, as it would perfectly emulate an attack on an actual PvP enemy, damage multipliers and all. It should be noted that even then we were aware of my--and by extension, Serenity's--power drop, yet we were not aware that power could go below 0.

As we were waiting for AquaticSpider to finish her business with Hellatious (explaining and giving tips on a few spell mechanics), Labyrinth_Magpie decided to grind unarmed in the meantime. This is where the first of my many deaths occurred. As I was technically an enemy to Daylight's fac, I could also receive the full brunt of Labyrinth_Magpie's attacks. Since we were also in the same party--and thus would share xp--it seemed that attacking eachother would show the most effective results. It didn't help that she had the rogue class, which significantly boosts unarmed damage. With these set of circumstances, me dying repeatedly would result in me having my unarmed level skyrocket.

After a few initial deaths--all of which emphatically OOC--Hellatious and AquaticSpider finished their conversation, and seeing our battle-grind strategy, decided to join in. Hellatious also decided to reap the harvests from being in the same party as Labyrinth_Magpie and I, and AquaticSpider still needed to test out her wolves (which I think still doesn't work). This lead to the largest amount of my deaths, and it was then I discovered that my power level could drop below 0.

It was then that Kehnn logged on.

Kehnn was a bit estranged to our grinding tactics, and so we explained to him what our grinding strategy was. Knowing that power drops on player death, Kehnn checked to see how this would effect Serenity's power level. It was to his surprise and delight that--combined with the sudden departure of two other Serenity members--we had actually dropped Serenity's power level to its lowest power in months. Seeing as how Redmond was ICly unable to defend Serenity. Kehnn and some of Daylight's online players decided to raid and claim most of Serenity's territory. This was a spur-of-the-moment decision, and it was only by chance that tyedye was not online to try and repel the invasion--something we reasoned that he (unfortunately to him) wouldn't have been able to do ICly even if he was online. Kehnn simply saw that Serenity was vulnerable OOCly and ICly, and thus he felt no qualms attacking.

(This is a bit long, so I'll talk about tying IC justifications in my next reply/post)
Posted Jan 22, 19
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Interesting; while that does seem to circumnavigate the "no one was online to defend" claim, it nevertheless manages to feel even more 'scummy'.

Whether intentional or not (in this case allegedly not), I don't believe lowering Serenity's powerlevel through OOC grinding should be the way Serenity lost this war. I'd be unbelievably pissed off if this happened to me, or us.
Joey-bae: "The front of Thyvor looks ugly"
Gudz-san: "We took inspiration from your face."
Posted Jan 22, 19 · Last edited Jan 22, 19 by SAC_PowerP...
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